fiestaturbo.com

[goglahey]

What?, How? , Where?

Any one tried it?

I know NMS does it, but must be something i can do myself.

/Allan

[j7aoc]

Cosworth set up is old and dated there's load of after market set up's which don't have all the s**t sensors which can go wrong. The standard frst loom and ecu is good for over 250bhp and 2 bar of boost so why spend money on older more to go wrong type management

[wildheart]

A brand new coswoth loom and L8 ECU is the way to go over frst rubbish anyday

[j7aoc]

A brand new coswoth loom and L8 ECU is the way to go over frst rubbish anyday

why's that then what do you get with using cossy management you don't get with the ofab. Why is the frst management rubbish it's easy to make a comment without any info to back it up ive spoken some of the best rs garage's in the uk and they said there no point in using cosworth management when you can get big bhp with a good remap

[j7aoc]

What?, How? , Where?

Any one tried it?

I know NMS does it, but must be something i can do myself.

/Allan

Before asking it's easyer to do a search http://www.fiestaturbo.com/forums/viewt ... management

[goglahey]

You se if you would spell Cosworth or "Cossi" like the rest of the world i might get something out of a search but you dont so i came up with squat.

Me beeing a dumb dane and all

Thanks for the tip, reson im asking is:

I can't get a remap in Denmark with the OFAC/B, so i would have to sail to you guys, or order a 195' chip 701'ones and the still i would'ent have a fully remapd engine.

Also the cost of 195' chip 701' is probely more than a cossi loom. Besides i can get the cossi ecu fully remaped here.

/Allan

Btw. I read that post, but it don't say how or if this possible so im still blank???????

[goglahey]

Btw. Im going to be running 14psi and i have just blown 2 pistons and all the bearings in the ingine + the turbo and the I/C i to trew out.

So will be needing a new Chip/ecu or what ever it takes to keep it from pinking againe.

/Allan

[j7aoc]

If your looking for big power on a frst the low comp forged pistons 195 chip 701's cossy fuel pump stage 3 head front mounted intercooler piper cam or kent t3 stage 2 turbo -31 run the car on ofab then you can run a 2.5 bar map sensor 20psi stage 2 lsd gearbox. If you need new management try omex you can map the car your self Get some pictures of your car nice to see a lefty

[j7aoc]

Btw. Im going to be running 14psi and i have just blown 2 pistons and all the bearings in the ingine + the turbo and the I/C i to trew out.

So will be needing a new Chip/ecu or what ever it takes to keep it from pinking againe.

/Allan

Running cosworth management won't stop blowing piston's most time's this is down to fueling should run bigger power car on 97ron and get your tune every so often to make sure ship shape and good oil change won't go a miss

[sailorbob]

Cosworth management can be transplanted onto any engine if you want to. Bear in mind that it's not just the ecu and loom you'll require but also all the Cosworth sensors. I think that once you bought it all and paid for it to be mapped to suit your engine specification it will cost more than chipping OFAB/OFAB with injectors etc. I expect a somewhere like MSD can provide you with a chip to suit your specification without having to resort to a live mapping session.

[j7aoc]

Cosworth management can be transplanted onto any engine if you want to. Bear in mind that it's not just the ecu and loom you'll require but also all the Cosworth sensors. I think that once you bought it all and paid for it to be mapped to suit your engine specification it will cost more than chipping OFAB/OFAB with injectors etc. I expect a somewhere like MSD can provide you with a chip to suit your specification without having to resort to a live mapping session.

MSD will map you a chip to what ever spec you want as sailorbob said there one of the best mappers in the uk http://www.motorsport-developments.co.u ... /index.php

[goglahey]

Since the engine blew up the new one will be:

Garrett GT25R
Piper 2½" exhaust
Fully rebild "new" std. engine
Std. pistons, head injectors
Kent 35 cam
"Pace" size I/C
50hp nos fogger system (was not why it blew up)
Sarchs clutch uprated to 300hp or that was it said
ERST S2 gearbox "rebuilt"
Bailey breather system


So all i need is a ecu to hit the magic 200bhp + nos

The chassi is rebuild to the max to withstand the hp so no probs. there.

Thanks Allan

[goglahey]

have read stu's post about all the things to take in considuration but just can't se where to put my money next to get the engine to run 200hp.

The std. injectors and head should be ok. But i need a new ecu or a chip that can take the 18psi i just read i have to pull to hit the 200hp

165' chip and cossi pump?

The engine and ecu will be tested at a remapping company so it will be running fine.

Thanks Allan

[j7aoc]

For 200bhp you will need uprated fuel pump and injectors you can get 200bhp with standard management if you what 18psi the ofab is easyer You want need cossy management for 200bhp

[goglahey]

Then it would be 701 injectors and a cossi pump from burtonpower, and the 197 chip from MSD?

And the standard pistons and rods should be just fine with 200hp and 50 nos = 220bhp or something like that?

Thanks Allan

[j7aoc]

Then it would be 701 injectors and a cossi pump from burtonpower, and the 197 chip from MSD?

And the standard pistons and rods should be just fine with 200hp and 50 nos = 220bhp or something like that?

Thanks Allan

MDS do a kit for £450 which is stage 2 around 195bhp (chip,701s,uprated actuator) you will need uprated fuel pump which is not in the kit I would looking to getting a stage 2 or3 head as that will give you around 20bhp

[goglahey]

I have a stage 2 ERST head but don't know if it fits the EFI manifold

Cant really find that offer on their website, a single chip cost 620p

Thanks Allan

[j7aoc]

I have a stage 2 ERST head but don't know if it fits the EFI manifold

Cant really find that offer on their website, a single chip cost 620p

Thanks Allan

ERST will be crap MFI so it's no good for EFI the offer is in fastford but hasn't been in there for some time the price's in there web site are all fitted just supplied is cheaper but if you email them they can give you a prise as you will need to pay for p+p

[BUTRE]

The 0FAB/0FAC ecu is really a simple ecu with the possible less sensores needed to run a MPI engine. It's too arsh on building boost and rods and gearboxes feel this.

Cossies ecu's will need a dizzy and you want to get away dizzys on a powerfull turbo engine. Ignition becomes critical and coilpack and Ford's wastespark is a must! Yes the cossie ecu can be modded to use Ford's coilpack.

With the cossie ecu cost why don't you go megasquirt fully modded with wideband and knock sensor? Properlly mapped its better than the 0FAB/0FAC and assle free modding TB's, sensors, etc like the cossie one.

[goglahey]

j7aoc: The ERST head is a stage 2, i'm not going for the MFI, just the ERST head with EFI but dont know if it ERST head will fit the EFI manifold because og the MFI and EFI manifolds beeing different.

BUTRE: MPI engine? dizzy? wastespark? assle free modding TB's?

Don't understand a word of that.

Speek english mate

Cheers Allan

[BUTRE]

j7aoc: The ERST head is a stage 2, i'm not going for the MFI, just the ERST head with EFI but dont know if it ERST head will fit the EFI manifold because og the MFI and EFI manifolds beeing different.

BUTRE: MPI engine? dizzy? wastespark? assle free modding TB's?

Don't understand a word of that.

Speek english mate

Cheers Allan

To use a ERST head with EFI you'll need a spacer plate or to grind open the "holes" on the head to clear for the injector spray.

MPI: Multi-Point Injection. At least one injector per cylinder.
Dizzy: Distributor.
Wasted Spark ignition: sparks are fired in pairs on both the exhaust and compression strokes. On the compression stroke you'll get ignition but on the exhaust the spark does nothing, so its wasted. It's pretty usuall this kind of ignition on nowadays engines and this wasted spark doesnt affect anything.
assle free modding TB's: You'll need to bolt a cossie throttle body (and its ISCV, spring return, etc) to the fiesta EFI inlet manifold. For the photos I've seen, it's not a straight fit.
Speek english mate: Yeah I know Have had a couple of problems in getting my point of view explained

[goglahey]

Thanks mate, that made allot more sence, technical slang english is not my best side

Don't think i will be going for the cossi, to much work

But i do think i will try to grind the space for the injectors on the ERST head, when the head beeing a stage 2 and all.

Thanks for the great help

Cheers
Allan

[wildheart]

A brand new coswoth loom and L8 ECU is the way to go over frst rubbish anyday

why's that then what do you get with using cossy management you don't get with the ofab. Why is the frst management rubbish it's easy to make a comment without any info to back it up ive spoken some of the best rs garage's in the uk and they said there no point in using cosworth management when you can get big bhp with a good remap

Speak to Karl @ NMS and he'll explain properly why the frst stuff is rubbish

[goglahey]

A brand new coswoth loom and L8 ECU is the way to go over frst rubbish anyday

why's that then what do you get with using cossy management you don't get with the ofab. Why is the frst management rubbish it's easy to make a comment without any info to back it up ive spoken some of the best rs garage's in the uk and they said there no point in using cosworth management when you can get big bhp with a good remap

Speak to Karl @ NMS and he'll explain properly why the frst stuff is rubbish

Whell if it's rubbish what would you use insted?
Speak to Karl @ NMS: Don't just write that!!!

Cheers Allan

[wildheart]

As said i would use a brand new cosworth loom and L8 ecu and get it live mapped.

[Oranoco]

I have a stage 2 ERST head but don't know if it fits the EFI manifold

Cant really find that offer on their website, a single chip cost 620p

Thanks Allan

ERST will be crap MFI so it's no good for EFI the offer is in fastford but hasn't been in there for some time the price's in there web site are all fitted just supplied is cheaper but if you email them they can give you a prise as you will need to pay for p+p

Steady fella the crap MFI is what is propelling my S2 to 150mph with almost 260bhp

Head's a no go though between the engines as the EFi head is shaped differently on th einlet side for starters

[wildheart]

Nothing wrong with MFI aslong as its setup correct.

Im peaking 20psi on mine with no problems

[j7aoc]

I've seen a few s2 on MFI do over 250bhp but i don't think i will be converting my frst any time soon

[BUTRE]

I was lucky to follow the discussion between tunners on other forum about FRST, ERST and cossie managment.

The main reason Karl doesn't like FRST management is because of the FRST owners and not the management itself! Ppl got missleaded on this.
FRST owners usually (since they are young) want more power and don't mod the FRST properly before live map. Any tunner who gets a FRST to live map wants the owner to have done properly its homework:

- Uprated fuel pump.
- Uprated IC.
- No leaks whatsoever.
- No turbo failure and a turbo to suit.
- Actuator working properly.
- No electrical problems (sensores, sensor plugs, coilpacks, spark plugs, etc)
- And so on...

This are the main complaints issued by Karl about FRST clients in general. All of this so that after live mapping the car when driving home in 5th gear and WOT the std fuel pump not beeing up to the job and lean mixtures giving a nasty hole on a piston. Whose the one to blame?

Looking only to the management, he said its pretty simple and basic ecu.


The MFI can give you safe 220bhp on a 1.6 CVH engine. Above that it starts going lean mixtures. MFI needs to be checked regulary and fine tunned.
Alot of tunners go 5th injector on the plenum or even before it. This doesn't give fuel evenly on the 4 cylinders. They will always run with different mixtures and it's not easy to say who is running lean or rich and assume its ok or safe.


I would go megasquirt ecu V3 with wideband and knock sensor and EFI

[sailorbob]

why don't you go megasquirt fully modded with wideband and knock sensor? Properlly mapped its better than the 0FAB/0FAC

Arguable. Where's the sensor fault handling/reporting with the MS? The coding itself is pretty poor compared to eec too. Philip Ringwood (http://www.extraefi.co.uk/) has produced a fair amount of extra code just to bring standard features to the MS.

[BUTRE]

why don't you go megasquirt fully modded with wideband and knock sensor? Properlly mapped its better than the 0FAB/0FAC

Arguable. Where's the sensor fault handling/reporting with the MS? The coding itself is pretty poor compared to eec too. Philip Ringwood (http://www.extraefi.co.uk/) has produced a fair amount of extra code just to bring standard features to the MS.

We are talking on having the best ecu possible on a budget. MS V3 has proven to work very well with any kind of engine and make it properly run well. Also it has more features than the FRST ecu. When you say the code is poor what are you talking about? It's simple and it works. You can go L8 ecu if you want an heavy not understandable code (only now there is a kit that makes this L8 ecu easier to map)... and at the end both ecu's properly mapped will make the engine run at it's best.

If you say Pectel T2... I got scared from only seeing it's software because it allows you to fine tune everything!!! But the cost...


If you can afford a L8 ecu modded to run the SCS/R&B kit, sensors, loom, inlet mods, etc... go for it! If not, MS V3 seems to be the best option VFM.

[wildheart]

I think its a bit unfair to say Karl doesnt like FRST owners!

Karl is my tuner and if you talk to him properly you'll understand why he doesnt like the frst managment.

[goglahey]

Whell me beeing a datatechnician and know my way around coding and by time also arround engines, maby i shall give the megasquirt a chance?

have see som guides on the net on the mapping of it, so how hard can it e

Cheers Allan

[BUTRE]

I think its a bit unfair to say Karl doesnt like FRST owners!

Yes it is, and been not that simple you can't put it in just one phrase. He didn't say "I don't like FRST owners" but said that the main reason he doesn't like the FRST ecu is because it's lack of features to deal with mechanical problems like the ones stated on my previous posts that are usually missleaded/less cared by FRST owners.

Any tunner when books a car needs and will demand sorting out issues that can become a problem after boosting up more power. Karl is no different and ppl just don't understand them or try to put their work in just one phrase that is always missunderstood.

Karl is my tuner and if you talk to him properly you'll understand why he doesnt like the frst managment.

On the other forum there was pages discussed by tunners and ecu's. Every tunner on that discussion properly stated why they like best this or that ecu. No doubts were left to be explained.

[sailorbob]

When you say the code is poor what are you talking about?

Only just got around to refreshing my memory about the MS code. A few of examples of where it's poor are;
i) Injector pulsewdith compensation vs battery voltage - The MS code treats this as linear which is wrong as injectors do not behave in this manner.
ii) Fast/slow idle rpm is switched according to a single coolant value, there's no interplolation between hot and cold to give a variable idle rpm according to temperature. There is also no idle adjust for ACT.
iii) Cranking flood clear is set at 0.3 mSecs, it's usual to set fuelling to 0 when flood clearing to speed up the clearing.
iv) There is no transient fueling adjustment for manifold filling/emptying.
v) There's no ratcheting of the closed TPS position to constantly find the lowest inputted value.

You could go on and find many more examples. My personal opinion about the MS is that it's cheap and cheerful but this is also it's weakness as it gives the impression to many that it's an easy way to get into DIY engine mapping. I suspect that there's many expensive engines out there being ruined by poor mapping and ignorance about the complexities of a modern engine control system.