fiestaturbo.com

[StreetDragster]

Cheers Andy we could make our own section up of the unwashed and unloved FRST's

Not sounding good, rang Kenny and he can't get more than 8psi out of it and he's had a water leak today. Suspect knackered turbocharger. Full report later

Guess 8psi will have to do for the summer then, over winter i'll sort the turbo out

Thanks

Matt

[StreetDragster]

Well bit of as mixed day today.

Rang up Kenny and he said that i should come back later on in the day, he's got a few more things to try out on my car to try and make it boost over 8psi. Went round later and he still couldnt get it over 8psi, and it had a small water leak from the bottom radiator hose, due to the mad rush on Wednesday night to relocate the radiator/intercooler.

So we chatted for a bit, i have a number of little jobs to do before it goes back to MSD, but the main job will be removing the head, and having the head drilled and tapped for the ERST manifold, loosing the adaptor plate.
Whilst this is being done i'll recheck the compression ratio and make any alterations to the pistons to reduce it if its too high.
We also chatted about the turbo, basically, its not right for the application, upsetting as its the only part of the build i didn't spec up or buy new.
I can say the an Escort RS Turbo T3 turbo is not suitable for a Zetec turbo conversion. At bear minimum a T3 with a larger exhaust housing, such as a 55 should be fitted.
Plan is now, subject to checking clearances, flangers being ok etc, i'm going to buy a GT28R roller bearing turbo and fit it to the ERST manifold. Turbos designed for 1800-2200cc engines running between 250-350BHP, sounds right up my street.


But then....

Went home, repaired the bottom radiator hose and took the car out for a spin..Jesus christ it goes well for 8psi. And i love my dump valve, its been ages since i've heard it properly. And the Quiafe ATB diff is great, i would recommend this to any Fiesta/Escort owner!
Going to put it on the rollers tomorrow anyway, just so i've got a baseline to judge any of my improvements against, not going to be able to make it to FITP though. I suspect it will only make 160bhp ish, but theres only one way to find out. Its running safety settings on the fuel so a little on the rich side.

Thats all for now, i'm off to use up some fuel and do some big wheely spins

Thanks

Matt

[Ruishy1]

Thats all for now, i'm off to use up some fuel and do some big wheely spins

thats what i like to hear matey

[FezzR]

so is there feeling that the adaptor plate is causing a problem, if so what if its not leaking

im assuming there is a conclusion the turbo exhaust housing is causing too much restriction? if so how was this conclusion arrived at?

if your getting a new turbo and the current manifold doesnt fit the head, would it not make sense to either make / commision a complete / customised manifold

why do you think the compression is too high? i would rather run slightly higher compression and lower boost,

might sound like im douting you or kenny but just genuine interest

[StreetDragster]

so is there feeling that the adaptor plate is causing a problem, if so what if its not leaking

Sorry, worded that wrongly, what i meant is that the adaptor plate is causing too much restriction, you see the round holes int he plate don't perfectly line up with the round holes int he exhaust manifold. So rather than having the full, round aperture for the air to flow through, there is an oval. Its quite a reduction in area when compared tot he oval ports ont he head.

im assuming there is a conclusion the turbo exhaust housing is causing too much restriction? if so how was this conclusion arrived at?

Yep, the car spools up very quickly, but runs out of puff very early in the rev range. My particular turbo appears to be faultly, possible crack in the wastegate/housing. This may be contributing to the problem, but if you think about it differently. The ERST T3 turbo is designed for a 1600, not a 2000cc, so its like its running a 5 cylinder engine.

if your getting a new turbo and the current manifold doesnt fit the head, would it not make sense to either make / commision a complete / customised manifold

Yep! After some measurements against my friends GT28R turbo, if the work involved to get it to fit and perform correctly, then a different manifold and turbo conbination will be priced up. Ideally, i'd like a Focus RS manifold and turbo, but they don't exactly grow on trees at the moment!

why do you think the compression is too high? i would rather run slightly higher compression and lower boost

I don't think its too high, just that i didn't actually calculate it accurately with a compressed head gasket etc and i would like yo know exactly what it is. I would also prefer the low down performance and less boost. Just want to be sure i'm not running 11:1 or something!

might sound like im douting you or kenny but just genuine interest

No worries pal, these were all the questions i asked Kenny. The guys at MSD know there stuff, i can couch for that!

Thanks

Matt

[FezzR]

knowing some of the other work you did im supprise u used the adapter if it was a a restriction,

you still planning on taking the head off?
i would avoid it personally, seeing as youve only just built it (not a labour issue btw)

i wouldnt go for the T3 either firm believer in the GT series and am constantly suprised by the number of people who hybrid them with older style turbos like the Td0 mitsi series

you will find ALOT of hybrid and modified GT28R's out there two, especially for the VAGs but modified in the right way to get the right function for given applications not sticking older style exhaust housing on like i mentioned above

there is a video on http://www.goapr.com with some very well designed fitting components for the GT23RS mainly the inlet pipe i think is very well designed, may give you some ideas

[StreetDragster]

knowing some of the other work you did im supprise u used the adapter if it was a a restriction,

Yep, it was one of those times when it was 'it'll be right'. Unfortuntely, it isn't

you still planning on taking the head off?
i would avoid it personally, seeing as youve only just built it (not a labour issue btw)

Not sure a tthe moment, depends really on whether i have the head drilled and tapped with new stud positions or i find a Zetec flanged manifold. If i find a zetec flanged manifold i'll probably leave the head on.

i wouldnt go for the T3 either firm believer in the GT series and am constantly suprised by the number of people who hybrid them with older style turbos like the Td0 mitsi series

you will find ALOT of hybrid and modified GT28R's out there two, especially for the VAGs but modified in the right way to get the right function for given applications not sticking older style exhaust housing on like i mentioned above

there is a video on http://www.goapr.com with some very well designed fitting components for the GT23RS mainly the inlet pipe i think is very well designed, may give you some ideas

Cheers, i'll look into that, heard nothing but good things about the roller bearing GT series. Know anywhere which i can get turbo's brand new for a decent price, best price i've found so far on the turbo i'm really interested in (GT28RS) is £1100. I'm going to speak to Mr Howell this week and see what he suggests and i'll report back


On a side note, took the car on the rollers today, quite impressed, at ~8psi boost i pulled 213bhp at the flywheel and 176.5bhp at the wheels. With a torque figure of 205 lbs/ft.
Not bad at all i thought for the boost and poor turbo.

Couple of pics for you if you want to look, the second one is 246kb



Right Click, Save As.....

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v145/StreetDragster/Power_Graph_Big.jpg

Got a poor quality video too, but its not very interesting, just a view on the operator running up the car on the rollers. Got a proper video on a friends digital video camera which i'll try and get uploaded.

Good day today, i'm enjoying the car much more now, just need to get a stronger, or geared starter motor to start it when hot.

Thanks

Matt

[Captain Tightpants]

Most excellent horsies, for boost!

Excellent work throughout mate. Glad your enjoying the fruits of alot of hard work.

Top car, top bloke.

Steve

[FezzR]

nice results mate,
is your max rpm held back at mo or is that your desired?

turbos you have could of options really, try and speak to a company using them see if there willing to supply one cheap, heared mention of a VAG company called JBS auto designs may be willing to do this but didnt hear it from that, or direct from yank is another cheap option speak to scrote i mean Scort regarding that as he has done this.
but then you need to be even more careful to ensure it is the spec you think when ordering it, because as im sure youve noticed they very in spec even more over there than here

[mrviper]

i would bet a fiver that your compression ratio is verry close to 9:1

[heeman10]

Hi Matt, I haven't been online much recently cos of exams etc, and have just come home for a short spell to work on mine. Just read a few of the latest bits of news, and the ups and downs you've been going through...

Sorry to hear it hasn't been as smooth as we all hoped, specially with something as pricey as the turbo...Disco Potato would definitely be a great addition (GT28RS), and if you're making 213bhp with only 8psi...if you're planning on using over 1 bar, you're definitely going to be healthily into 300bhp territory.

Sorry to hear you can't make it to the show, but with the safe set-up setup you have now from MSD, I'm sure you'll be able to have plenty of fun! I think I'll be ok with the T3 on mine as I'm only aiming for 200-215bhp, and it's just a weedy little 1.8

Good luck Matt, catch up with you in a bit

[FezzR]

the turbo...Disco Potato would definitely be a great addition (GT28RS)

someones been doing there research

[dannyboy]

Sorry to hear about the problems Matt, but thats good power for 8psi. As for finding an RS focus manifold and turbo, have you not thought of ringing someone like SCC or Pumaspeed, they do a fair bit of work on these cars, upgrading to Primary design manifolds and GT series turbos etc, they must do something with the old units and you might be able to pick one up cheaper that you think, hth

[Xr_Dub]

Just been reading this... havnt read it in a while...
ups and downs hey ...

But thats a good bhp figure for 8psi boost..

U will defo be in the 300bhp mark when ure running higher boost..

keep on rolling..

I [ERRR] be starting my conversion soon... got the gearbox,lump,ecu & loom just need bits and bobs really...

thanks,
atif

[StreetDragster]

Most excellent horsies, for boost!

Excellent work throughout mate. Glad your enjoying the fruits of alot of hard work.

Top car, top bloke.

Steve

Cheers Steve, it drives great at the moment, i'm very happy with it. I've took it off the road this week until my super starter motor (gear reduction one) arrives and hopefully it'll hot start then, and i can use it as my daliy driver for summer.

nice results mate,
is your max rpm held back at mo or is that your desired?

Cheers, That was just where horsepower started to drop off so no point pushing it higher, at the moment i thinkt he rev limit is still standard FRST

i would bet a fiver that your compression ratio is verry close to 9:1

Probably, but i drives well for the way i intend on using it. if the head ever comes off i'll check the CR accurately and maybe adjust the pistons to lower.

Sorry to hear it hasn't been as smooth as we all hoped, specially with something as pricey as the turbo...Disco Potato would definitely be a great addition (GT28RS), and if you're making 213bhp with only 8psi...if you're planning on using over 1 bar, you're definitely going to be healthily into 300bhp territory.

Hi James, Disco Potato is definately appearing to be the weapons of choice so far, i'll ask Ian Howell and see what he thinks to that turbo and possible manifold arrangements, he may be able to supply one cheap(er) too.

Sorry to hear about the problems Matt, but thats good power for 8psi. As for finding an RS focus manifold and turbo, have you not thought of ringing someone like SCC or Pumaspeed, they do a fair bit of work on these cars, upgrading to Primary design manifolds and GT series turbos etc, they must do something with the old units and you might be able to pick one up cheaper that you think, hth

Cheers Danny, thats a great idea, i'll ring them this week and see if hey can help out.

Just been reading this... havnt read it in a while...
ups and downs hey ...

But thats a good bhp figure for 8psi boost..

U will defo be in the 300bhp mark when ure running higher boost..

keep on rolling..

I [ERRR] be starting my conversion soon... got the gearbox,lump,ecu & loom just need bits and bobs really...

thanks,
atif

Good luck mate, it is worth it in the long run, but its a mission to get there!

Thanks

Matt

[heeman10]

I sincerely hope you didn't get your starter motor from Racemettle. My dad went through three from them for the Zetec in his Caterham, and they cranked so slowly compared to the standard starter that it wouldn't even start up!!

[StreetDragster]

The one i'm hopefully ordering is a Brise starter motor from Burton Power , not the same one as your dad i hope

Thanks

Matt

[Hartza]

ERST turbo with original A/R .36 is small even for 1.6 CVH... Well, it spools up quickly, but backpressure and heat grows exponentaly if you raise boost.
I made allso an adapter plate for Zetec head for ERST manifold, and the holes don´t line up perfectly. Little porting should do the trick I´ll add some pictures some day.

[Max M4X WW]

Christ! I dont know much about these ZT's but at just over standard FRST boost thats gotta be a good figure!!

[StreetDragster]

Cheers Pumabuild, £150+vat+delivery for a used Focus RS Manifold

Its in the post

Thanks

Matt

[heeman10]

Not bad at all!!!

[disc]

My home made adapter plate:

Solid aluminium block:



A little bit of machine work:



Ready for handwork:





Holes for head drilled:



Ports planing:



Initial port holes:



Trial fit, a lot of work needed:



Userfull tool:



Half done:







Before some sanding (head side):



More sanding needed (opposite, manifold side):



Threading:



Almost done:

[Captain Tightpants]

A better way than an adapter plate, is to machine the head. Obviously the best way is a decent manifold. Like has been ordered now by the looks! Hope to see some nice pics of that!

We did this on a zetec head, (inlet side shown).

Sorry for the thread hi-jack Mr Dragster!





With any luck your manifold will look sweet!



Steve

[Ruishy1]

His manifold wont look like that anyway mate
but he does have one awesome motor

[Captain Tightpants]

His manifold wont look like that anyway mate
but he does have one awesome motor

Ah, would I be correct in assuming its the standard manifold? Cast jobbie?

Steve

[StreetDragster]

Morning Guys.

Looking good disc, yours looks like it'll work better than mine, mines steel and damn hard to cut/port out. I'm mainly changing the manifold for the addition radiator>turbo clearance i'll get.

Scort, hyjack away, i don't mind As Ruishy 1 said, its a cast jobby, so doesn't quite look as cool as the tubular one, which is a shame, but if you look at it from the top, its very narrow, which is great. It'll hold the turbo high and close to the block giving my fields of room between the radiator hopefully



Also, its looks like the weapon of choice is going to be a Disco Potato, with the 0.64 exhaust housing and the 51mm inlet pipe. Just need to do some money juggling to pay for it and then i'll look into fitting it all. I'm probably going to wrap the exhaust side and the manifold to as per Mr Hardy, should help drop ACT's a fair bit.

Probably have to alter the exhaust again though, grrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

Thanks

Matt

[Ruishy1]

glad its all coming together nicely mate, love the sleeper look, many scooby-doos and the like are gonna be shown a very dirty but very fast pair of heels !

[StreetDragster]

Hummmm, not good!





Not sure what happened. Looks like the Disco Potato will have to wait until i sort this little dilemma out!

Thanks

Matt

P.S Head removed to see why engine was tight when hot, preventing hot starting.

[heeman10]

Bloody hell, what on earth caused that I wonder? There's a serious amount of material missing there Are the other three as ok as they look in the pic? Any damage to the head?

[StreetDragster]

Dunno pal, being investigated.

Head appears ok and the other three appear fine ??

Thanks

Matt

[heeman10]

I hope not too much else has been damaged in the process, and you find a simple cause/solution. Looks like it's coming out again though hey? Good luck Matt...keep us updated as usual.

[Captain Tightpants]

Oh f**k.

What an absoloute bugger.

Think I would cry!

Steve

[StreetDragster]

Oh fouquette.

What an absoloute bugger.

Think I would cry!

Steve

I was stood next to the car, looking at the fuel can and a lighter, and then after a bit i was seriously considering putting a CVH back in!

Quick call to Ian has rested my mind though, think what i'm going to do it fit some of his Arias pistons, but take the whole engine to him and Ian is going to bore, hone, fit the pistons. Costs should be low as he shouldn't need many parts and he can check all the things on it to make sure its all tickity boo.

I hope not too much else has been damaged in the process, and you find a simple cause/solution. Looks like it's coming out again though hey? Good luck Matt...keep us updated as usual.

Most looks ok apart from that pistons, block bore appears fine, head appears fine, quite lucky really. I presume most of that metal has been through the turbo, probably explains why its damaged! Hopefully Ian will check it all over for me, shame that the ARP bolts will take 3 weeks to get here (AGAIN!).
Good job i have an engine crane!

Another thing on the turbo idea though lads which i could do with help on...

My current arrangement, has a T3 turbo on an ERST manifold, which holds the turbo from the side, ok..

Looking at the pictures of the GT28RS (http://www.turbobygarrett.com/turbobygarrett/images/garrett_inside/Garrett_Cat%207%2017%2013.pdf), and comparing it too my Focus RS Manifold, The GT28RS will be held from the top.
So when you look on the wastegate end, when installed in the car on the focus manifold, the wastegate will be on the left and the exhaust port on the right, horizontally.

Now, to connect to the exhaust, an elbow needs to go on there. I presume, as my ERST turbo is held from the side, the elbow will be 90 degrees out on the stud pattern?? Is this right? And if so, anyone suggest an elbow which should work?

Thanks

Matt

[disc]

Holy sh!t...

[Hartza]

piston looks cleaner, are you sure that injector of that particular cylinder is firing ok or an air leak? Too lean mixture maybe, it would be shame to fry next piston too... What about spark plugs, are they all ok?