fiestaturbo.com

[Si_Dave]

Hi Guys, just before I start i must say that i will try and make this as simple as possible, and any help would be greatly appreciated, Thanks.

Right, as some people may know I am hoping to put a 2L Series 2 Zetec Engine into my Mk3.5 Fiesta Si at some point, I have the engine and have a 2L Focus Inlet Manifold. However, i have been increasily researching into running throttle bodies on my conversion. I don't have a massive amount of money as yet, but come summer I will be working full time, so my questions are as follows...

1. First thing is first, if I run a standard Zetec engine (internally) just on throttlo bodies (no cams, high compression ratio etc as yet) will I need to replace head bolts and crank/main end bolts with ARP items??? I may decide to use cams at a later date, would I need to upgrade to these higher tensile bolts then???

2. Throttle Bodies Option:
I have done some research into the different kind of complete 'plug and play' kits available for the 2L Zetec and have several options:
- Weber Alpha TB kit (with Alpha management), basically a plug and play kit containing everything needed £2000 Approx inc VAT. Fron Northhampton Motorsport. Doesn't give details on TB size tho. 45mm?
- There are also Jenvey kits available.
- Plus Weber kits with Omex management, using 45mm throttle Bodies.

The other option is bike throttle bodies. but something I am concerned with is how easily they would get through the MOT with regard to emissions. If they are set up properly should they get through no problem?? When running a temporary cat obviously.

Have read about ASAD running Suzuki GSXR 1000 TB's with Megasquirt management, but I don't really want to go into that detail with the management side of things. Hence the reason for a plug and play kit, but without the massive cost lol.

So really guys I am asking for your opinions on what would be the best option, if I can justify spending £2000 on a kit then I will save up and spend it, to do the job right. Otherwise, I will reach a compromise with bike TB's. Thanks a lot for your help...

Regards,
Dave

[freak power]

1. A standard engine will cope with power increase so you don't have to splash out on a rebuild unless its a really high miles engine.

2. I used to have the Alpha kit and would say its not the best with little options of swapping parts. I have now swapped to Jenvey T/B and a DTA ecu. You can't go wrong with Jenvey

[SamT]

if your happy to pay 2k for some tb's then fine lol do it

but when i was doin this i decided to use bike tb's, wrked out sooo sooo much cheaper, and it's great fun making it all and getting it running for the first time yourself.

as said tho internally your be fine no need for arp bolts etc.

Have read about ASAD running Suzuki GSXR 1000 TB's with Megasquirt management, but I don't really want to go into that detail with the management side of things. Hence the reason for a plug and play kit, but without the massive cost lol.

thats exactly what i done, and ended up doin it all for well under a grand mate. But all these kits will come wth management, just i pressume that for the 2k price they will be mapping it aswell?

[Si_Dave]

Right thanks very much for your help guys...

Freakpower - Thanks for clearing some points up with regard to rebuilding the engine etc. With regard to to you saying that you used to have Alpha management and you found that it was quite restrictive, after doing some more research on the matter this morning i found that this is definately the case. For example, the Weber Alpha TB kit I have seen HAS to be taken back to the manufacturers when modifications are made etc for remapping, such as cams etc. You can't take it to a reputable rolling road which is closer to home. Even then it doesn't sound like the kit has much scope for upgrades with regard to the Alpha management.

Jayz - To be honest mate, if i can get away with doing the work myself with bike throttle bodies and spending half as much money, but still doing a good job, then I don't mind putting in the extra effort with the mapping etc. The reason i said I wouldn't mind paying the 2K asking price, was if it was far superior to using bike TB's with other forms of management, in other words I was getting a great product for the high cost, if you get me lol!

To be honest, I too am now leaning towards getting Suzuki GSXR 1000 TB's with a cheap but cheerful management system, like Megasquirt. This is what you have done???

Thanks a lot for your help guys

Dave

[freak power]

I had to travel over 100 miles to MBE in Lincoln to get my car remapped.
Now i've swapped to a DTA i only have to travel 15 mile to The racing line or AET Turbos to get a mapping on a Dyna pack or a Dyno Dynamics dyno.

[Si_Dave]

Spot on, makes a lot of sense mate.

I think I am defo going to go with bike throttle bodies I think now, thanks for the help guys. No doubt I will be asking more questions soon lol!

Regards

Dave

[lucasdemoley]

Anyone know the costs of getting ms mapped properly?

[freak power]

Anyone know the costs of getting ms mapped properly?

£400-£600

[Asad]

Hi,

Its no surprise that I would recommend the Bike/Megasquirt route as I went down it myself.

What I can point out is that there are now a lot more of these conversions out there. When I did it, there were no real base maps, etc. Now I could give you 4 or 5 with different configurations (1.8, 2.0, bigger injectors etc)

What this means is the time required to get it up and running is vastly reduced.

In terms of what would give you better perfomance etc, I think you would be hard pressed to find one between a well set up Jenvey etc and well set up Bike TBs.

Tuning wise, I paid £80 to set up my car on the rollers with MS. With the TBs, I tuned it all myself and had it running in 30minutes. Now, you have Autotune built in, and with a wideband O2 sensor, you can run in closed loop mode where the MS will automatically adjust to the correct AFR. Again, and good base map will get you 80-90% of the way there.

Finally, if you do wish to get it set up on rollers, Engine Advantages in Essex quoted me £115 to set up the Megasquirt. The tuner has experience of MS too.

All in all, you would save a lot of money, and have the satisfaction of having built it yourself. Not to mention the costs you will save as you learn how to tune the MS, and use that with any future mods.

Finally, once you do have the map tuned to how you like it, you will not need to touch it again. I have never had any issues whatsoever with my MS or TBs for that matter. Very reliable.

HTH


Asad

[lucasdemoley]

Cheers for that post asad, contained just the information i need!

[Si_Dave]

I agree, great information there Asad . Have read your post a number of times and really respect the work you have done. Would you mind me Pming you some question about the TB's when I am on the look out for some in the near future, as well as megasquirt etc.

Cheers,
Dave

[lucasdemoley]

Soz to hijack a little, asad, would the connection board thing you made for the ms to the ford plug work on v3? If so, could you make another one up, and how much would you want?

cheers!

[Asad]

Hi,

Thanks

Yeah feel free to PM me or add me to MSN. Im always willing to help.

The board I made was for V2.2. It would not be compatible for V3.

Its not too hard to make the board with approximately £10 worth or materials.

Asad